Sex Education Must be LGBTQ+ Inclusive or It Isn't Sex Education

Sex education shouldn’t solely be about anatomy, condom use, and STIs. It should also include education on consent, healthy relationships, and different sexual orientations and gender identities. Jennifer Driver, Vice President of Policy and Strategic Partnerships at SIECUS: Sex Ed For Social Change, sits down to talk with us about why positive LGBTQ+ representation and inclusive, medically-accurate information makes a huge difference in sex education courses.

 Sex education is disparate around the U.S.; depending on where you are in the country, your sex education experience can be different based on yours state, county, school, and even teacher. In fact, the majority of young people aren’t educated on even half of the sex education topics that the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention recommends. There is also an existing racial disparity in who accesses comprehensive sex education, with Black students and students of color often getting an abstinence-only frame.

Some states actually require that when sex educators or teachers talk about LGBTQ+ relationships, they need to talk about it in a negative light (These states are also known no promo-homo states). This is damaging for young LBGTQ+ people to hear and perpetuates heteronormativity as a standard. If states or districts have LGBTQ+ inclusive policies in schools. suicide and bullying rate among students drops in general. It’s important that sex education references LGBTQ+ historical moments and figures (like Stonewall and Marsha P. Johnson), includes information for transgender and non-binary individuals and reduces stigma. 

LGBTQ+ young people of color deserve more from sex education, too. This intersection of identities means it is vital to talk about how history oppression relates to race, sexual orientation, and gender identity. Sex education can be a vehicle to examine power, culture, racism, how individuals move through the world, and more. Comprehensive and inclusive sex education can be life-changing and life-saving. Research from GLSEN found that inclusive sex education made LGBTQ+ young people feel safer and made peers more accepting of LGBTQ+ students.

Links from this episode

SIECUS: Sex Ed For Social Change on Twitter
SIECUS: Sex Ed For Social Change on Facebook
GLSEN Website
More information on the Real Education for Health Youth Act and the Youth Access to Sexual Health Services Act
Killing the Black Body: Race, Reproduction, and the Meaning of
Liberty by Dorothy Roberts
How to Be an Antiracist by Ibram X. Kendi
All Boys Aren’t Blue by George M. Johnson

Transcript

Jennie: Welcome to RePROs Fight Back, a podcast where we explore all things reproductive health, rights and justice. I'm your host, Jennie Wetter, and I'll be helping you stay informed around issues like birth control, abortion, sex education and LGBTQ issues and much, much more-- giving you the tools you need to take action and fight back. Okay, let's dive in.

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Jennie: I’m Jennie, your host, and my preferred pronouns are she/her. I hope everybody is doing well. It is the end of June. What? I'm not really sure when that happened. This year has gone so fast/weeks are never ending. I don't know about you all. And maybe by the time this episode comes out, we'll know, but like waiting on a couple of reproductive rights related Supreme Court decisions and like having to log in Monday at 10:00 AM and Thursday at 10:00 AM to like find out if the Supreme Court's going to decide if we have rights or not is exhausting. And as of Friday, which is when I'm recording this, we don't know. We'll have to tune back in on Monday and Thursday next week. And it's just like this panic and nervousness and fear. That just is always in the background right now on top of the other panic and fear that has been in the consistent background for the last months. So last episode, I talked about the importance of doing the work. So, you know, I think that still holds true. Obviously, the world is not magically better. We need to make sure we're doing the work. And just because the protests have quieted down a little bit or the reporting on them, it has quieted down a little bit, it does not mean Black lives matter any less. And like, we can quit doing the work. We need to keep doing the work. So I thought I'd talk a little bit about some of the things that I've been doing. So I think I mentioned last time have been doing some donating, you know, putting a little bit towards multiple causes. You know, I've been trying to do that as I can. I've been trying to raise it up on social media and that's an easy lift, right? Like making sure you're following the people, making sure you're following Black people, making sure you are following just like the whole community that is doing the work on this and that you're raising their voices as well. So I try to be really intentional with that when I use social media. So just things to keep in mind for me. I am also a reader. Books are my vice. I read a lot all the time. So I have been doing the reading. So one of the first ones I read recently was Killing the Black Body: Race, Reproduction and the Meaning of Liberty by Dorothy Roberts. It's a really great place to look at for reproductive justice. It's from 1997. So, you know, it's a little older, but it still holds up. Like it's still definitely worth a read. And to really look at some things that particularly white people we might not have thought about, it was an important read. I also read How to be an Anti-Racist by Ibram X. Kendi, which was also good. I feel like, you know, I follow enough people on social and read enough things that none of this was too new for me, but it was still a good place to start.

Jennie: And I think it's definitely a book worth recommending. And then, you know, it's not enough just to read the books that are like the workbooks, right? We need to be reading Black authors too. And that includes Black memoirs. So I also read All Boys Aren't Blue by George M. Johnson. It was really good. And I think it is definitely worth a read for people. And also there have been efforts to blackout the bestseller list. So buying books by Black authors, so not just nonfiction fiction. So I've also been buying that. I haven't read any new fiction though the moment, but there are so many great Black authors out there. So make sure that you are being thoughtful and considerate when you are buying books and making sure you're not buying from only white authors or only white men. Like it's really important to make sure that you were hearing from a full range of people. It's something that I have been really putting the effort into and yeah, that's been my big thing that I've been working on is doing the work reading. I still have several more, I want to read and it will be a consistent thing, right? Like you always should be striving to grow and learn more. So I am going to be better, have not always been great about reading nonfiction books. Reading has always kind of been my escape. So I have not read as much nonfiction. So I'm trying to put the effort in to be better about reading nonfiction. So if anybody has any books they want to recommend, I am always open to suggestions. I think those are the major things that I have had going on recently. I'm still working from home, still with the kitties today. Actually, while I'm recording, this is their five-year adoptivaversary. So that's exciting. And Cinder was crying in the background while I was recording. I don't think you're going to be able to hear her though. She wasn't quite on mic, but she was very loud. In the last episode, she came up and cried right in the microphone. She just wants to be included. So with that, we'll turn to this week's interview. I am so excited. It was a great interview.

Jennie: So I talked to Jennifer Driver at SIECUS: Sex Ed for Social Change, and it's an important and great conversation. So with that, I'm going to turn it over to the interview. Enjoy. Hi Jennifer. Thank you so much for being here.

Jennifer: Hi, thanks for having me. I'm really excited.

Jennie: So before we get started, do you want to do a real quick introduction? Who you are your pronouns?

Jennifer: Sure. My name's Jennifer Driver. I am the Vice President of Policy and Strategic Partnerships with SIECUS: Sex Ed for Social Change. My pronouns are she/her. And I always, this is always really important to me, but I identify as a Black woman, and that's who I am.

Jennie: Great. And you know, so we're recording this and it's going to come out right as pride month is coming to an end. So it seems like a great chance to talk about that LGBTQ rights are year round. And we shouldn't just talk about them this one month. So it's a great opportunity to also talk about sex ed.

Jennifer: Yes. Always a great time to talk about sex education. I'm really excited that we're able to do that.

Jennie: Yeah. And so many Americans have super shitty sex ed. So it's one of my life passion projects that I don't get to work on as much.

Jennifer: Oh. I went to school in Alabama. Birmingham, Alabama, and I was taught by a driver's ed teacher who gave us a book and told us to read a paragraph on HIV. And that was the sex ed that I received in 11th grade. And that was what I got.

Jennie: I had it from a nun.

Jennifer: Oh wow.

Jennie: If you remember like the fifth grade class where they like separated boys and girls and like girls got this really bulky pads? They really didn’t tell you what to do or like what was going to happen… That was it.

Jennifer: Yeah. I had that version and I didn't have anything in high school. Yeah. They failed us.

Jennie: Yeah, for sure. Like I went and faced the world and I was like, wait, what? Learned so much in the course of my job.

Jennifer: Well, it's actually really interesting because, so I used to teach undergrad students when I lived in Atlanta. Yeah. You know, this was before the #MeToo wave really happened. Well, we were talking about consent and I'm sure we'll talk a little bit more about that little later, but yeah. One of the things that still sticks with me to this day was this guy that did not understand, or he was like coming to the realization of consent and like what that really meant and, his face... and you could just see that he was just devastated because like he was making the connections that I didn't get consent when having sex. And he was like, why didn't anyone tell me it still haunts me. I can see his face still. And the pain that he was kind of experiencing. So we can shift this now to like, what does sex education currently look like? But consent isn't really a part of a lot of sex ed still. Oh, it's not because you know, the #MeToo movement happened. And then people wanted to talk about consent, but they were generally talk to you about it from the lens of adults employment. And so when we got down to young people, they really struggled with the definition or they really struggled with, you know, how do we talk about consent? And they could only think about it in a sexual nature. And so what I had to remind people, we talk about consent every day, whether you're talking to like a kindergartener or a really young person, like you have to ask for things you want, like, ‘can I have your pencil?’ and being okay with the no. And like, these are the variables, framework, and baseline conversations that we are teaching for later in life. And so when I was able to start connecting those dots, people started to get, okay-- deep breath. We can have these conversations about consent. It's not this big, scary word that we were teaching and this concept that we were teaching, but I'm seeing more and more now where states are starting to have stronger conversations around consent, stronger language and messaging around consent. And you know, in that aspect, it's nice. I think we still have a lot of work to do, but you know, we're starting.

Jennie: And so that's positive. So beyond the consent conversation, what does the state of sex ed currently look like in the U.S. so, you know, it's not great and like you and I were just talking about our experiences with sex education. And I think it's really indicative kind of where we are as a country and like what we've been providing.

Jennifer: I'm assuming that we're around the same age. So today how you receive sex education can be very widespread depending on where you are in the country. So it really does depend where you live largely, but what state you're coming in from even down to the very localized-- what school you're in, who you have as a teacher, is that teacher going to be really comfortable teaching sex education? So it can vary from classroom to classroom. Like that's how varied sex education is right now. So put together kind of this patchwork approach across the country and providing sex education for young people. And we are doing a disservice, we have a lot of work that we need to do to get sex education, to where it should be. You know, the CDC actually puts out this report that looks at they've classified like these 20 sexual health topics and the majority of young people, whether in high school or in middle school, don't actually get even half of the topics that the CDC has identified that they're supposed to get. So we still have a long way to go. And that's really kind of been our baseline for what should be taught. We also, you know, there's some national sex ed standards. I mean, it's really hard to get the districts to, to teach to the standards… we have a long way to go. And it really depends on where you live, the type of sex ed you're going to get. The one other thing that I'll say to this, it also, there was a racial disparity among who gets high quality sex education. We know that people of color, Black students generally get an abstinence only frame message, comprehensive sex education is generally provided in those schools that are well funded. Again, there's a racial disparity among students who go to well-funded schools versus students who don't. So, you know, there's a racial disparity. And then there's just also, you know, kind of this class disparity among who gets really high-quality sex education.

Jennie: So beyond the consent conversation, what, what does the state of sex ed currently look like in the U.S.?

Jennifer: What's really interesting is like, you know, I think of big cities… people think of states, right? So they think California, oh, but California [has good sex ed]. But even in California, there is a huge pushback against sex education. And that can be frustrating for other states, rural states, states that aren't as blue because they're thinking, well, if they can't get it in California, what can I get? So there's this frustration and this also this rub about who can actually have strong access to sex education.

Jennie: I don't know why that surprises me because…absolutely. I guess I just think, you know, like big cities would have better sex ed. They tend to be more democratic, tend to have better sex ed. So like, I think that's how my brain was sorting it, but yeah, that makes total sense what you said.

Jennifer: That's right. So some states actually require that when you talk about LGBTQ relationships, that you talk about it in a negative light. And so we have these states, these ‘no promo homo’ states that actually say that you're talking about the negative outcomes of a homosexual relationship and that relationships are these heterosexual monogamous, usually in monogamous relationships. And so when you're a young person and you're showing up, and that's the messages that you received, it's troubling. I was teaching and we were looking at students in Georgia and in one of these classes, they had to write a letter to your future spouse. And so this guy, he wrote, you know, the idea was to write a letter to his future wife. And he said, “dear future wife, in the future, you don't actually exist because I'm gay and you would be a man.” And so that was his letter, but he turned in to really push back in his way to push back, like, yeah, you know, I’m here and I'm gay. The information that I receive should reflect my lived experiences. And, you know, that's not even getting into right now, so very few states make sure that it is LGBTQ inclusive and some do it in a negative way. So, you know, I remember growing up, I mentioned, I am from Alabama. I was horrible in school. You know, C’s, D’s, was that student that barely got by. And so when I got to, I think it was around ninth grade, actually. It was the first time that I had a teacher who looked like me. She taught geometry and I got her class. It's just first time I'd ever had a Black teacher and I thrived. It was so great. We had a connection, had shared experiences, this underlying common connection that we have. I can't tell you anything else I learned in school, but I can still tell you what an isosceles triangle is, you know, and so, like, what's really important. And I say this story to say, like, it's really important that you feel a connection to the information that you're learning. You feel a connection to the teachers that are teaching it. And you feel that your lived experiences are reflected, and far too many of our LGBTQ youth in class or feeling like their experiences are either erased, they're not present, and they're intentionally being left out of the conversation. And there's research that shows that for LGBTQ young people, if their state or district has policies that are really supportive of them, the rates of bullying and suicide among them and their heterosexual peers actually decreases. And so it's really important that when we're looking at sex education, that we are doing it in a way that's reflective and inclusive of LGBTQ young people. The other thing that I'll say to that really quickly is that, you know, I saw this post, we did this LGBTQ week of action this week. And so there was this Twitter storm and there was this one post that said, you know, ‘Black history, LGBTQ history is sex education’. And that's so true, right? So that needs to be part of the sex education that we are presenting. And it's not.

Jennie: Absolutely. I mean, obviously going to Catholic school in the nineties, clearly mine was… gay people didn't really exist. And if they did, it was negative. That doesn't help anybody. So in your dream world, what would LGBTQ inclusive sex ed look like?

Jennifer: Yeah. So in my dream world that we are talking at a very young age, right? A ton of differences, right? Some people look like them, some people who don't, you know, so you're talking a really young age, so that five, six, seven-year old’s can really understand that. And then you gradually increased him deeper conversations. So what I would love is us to start at a kindergarten and then go all the way up. And it's, you know, across the life span, I would love to see LGBTQ history reflected as part of sex education. Right? So we're talking about culture and maybe Stonewall and Marsha P. Johnson, the really historical figures that have happened throughout LGBTQ history. I would love to talk about what it means to be trans. And I remember a young person told me, you know, no one talked about…like what sex is like for a trans individual, and this person was trans. And she was like, really struggling with that. And so making sure that when we are talking about the act of sex that we are including all of that for trans and queer and gender non-binary folks. I also think that, you know, we're talking about relationships in a way that's not stigmatizing or shaming, and we're not talking HIV only, and that's considered our LGBTQ class information. Right. So that there's always like a stigma that comes along and they're stereotypes. So I would love to get rid of that. And I would want to make sure that we were just talking about not only sexual orientation, but also talking about gender identity. Often when we say LGBTQ folks only sexual orientation, and they really leave out gender and I would love to see more of gender really play a role in sex ed. So that's just some initial thoughts.

Jennie: Yeah. And I think that's one of those things I think gets lost. And I think the younger generation is much better with it, like sexual orientation versus gender identity, but there's definitely a long way to go to make sure people understand that. And I think some of that education needs to also be done to adults who clearly had the terrible sex ed and need a better understanding. So I know another area, it needs to be LGBTQ inclusive, but it also needs to address LGBTQ youth of color.

Jennifer: That's right. You know, LGBTQ youth of color are showing up with these, you know, the, these multiple identities, both your, kind of your gender identity, your sexual orientation, but also the compounding of your racial identity. And how do we make space to talk about race and our LGBTQ identity and have those conversations of how overlapping oppressions are showing up and are at play within school systems? And so we don't do a great job. I mean, we found that out right now when we're talking about this country's history, as it relates to Black folks in this country. And so there's that gap there where we need to do a better job of talking about LGBTQ youth of color and really what it means to be Black or Latino and LGBTQ.

Jennie: Yeah. And I think, you know, this is something we talked about with Chris when she was on the podcast-- was talking about how sex ed is also a space to kind of talk about race and other things that hasn't been available in a lot of other spaces in school.

Jennifer: Yeah. It's actually not available in a lot of places in school. Yeah. We have done a really awful job in this country. Of really erasing and putting forth kind of this white lens to education, whether it be history, social studies, whatever. So sex education is this way to really look at power and oppression and racism. And so like generally when people think of sex education, they're only thinking of, you know, reproductive health and sex, but it can be so much more, it's a time where we're talking about culture and norms and kind of how you move throughout this world, how we make assumptions about other folks versus biases. And so this is a time where we can really get rid of this Eurocentric mind frame that we're been in and really look at racism and how it shows up not only within, but kind of just throughout all of our lives.

Jennie: Yeah, for sure. So, you know, if we can make this happen and we'll talk about how to make that happen, what would it mean? What would it mean for LGBTQ youth actually, even just youth to get this much better version of sex ed?

Jennifer: I think it could be lifesaving. I mentioned earlier about the rates of bullying and suicide that go down-- it's life changing. I've seen the impact when I have been around folks who identify or are very similar to me and the connection that I feel and the safety that I have felt. And that's the same thing for our young people. GLSEN has done some kind of wonderful, detailed information on their national school climate. Um, how inclusive sex ed positively impacts LGBTQ young people. What they found is when queer youth who have sex education, that's inclusive, they reported that they were less likely to feel unsafe because of their sexual orientation or gender identity. And they were actually more likely to report their classmates were accepting of LGBTQ young people. And that there’s lower levels of victimization because, okay, that was either sexual orientation and gender identity. And so that's life altering. They've also looked at studies that look at that, you know, the rates of mental health issues like anxiety and depression and suicide compared to that non-LGBTQ peers. Okay. By having these affirming spaces within sex education, it's a vital part of addressing these disparities. The other thing that I want to point out too though, is, you know, often we think of sex education as kind of a standalone class and, you know, we try to set up these safe environments there, but if the outside world and your school system environment, it's not affirming and that's going to impact the way that you show up in the sex ed classrooms. And so what we work to do is not only look at, you know, that sex ed classroom, but how do we create these safe and supportive environments for LGBTQ young people even before they walk into the classroom?

Jennie: Yeah, no, I think that is really true. I mentioned going to Catholic school, but I also went to a really rural high school in Wisconsin. So really white, really conservative. So it would have been great if like the kids were really affirming, but the broader community also needs to be for people to be able to live their truth.

Jennifer: That's exactly right. So kids only learn from what they see and what they hear. And so when they show up in the classroom, that's going to impact their LGBTQ peers or themselves, because these are the things that they're hearing and they're seeing. And whether you show up in those classrooms and you're saying, okay, well, this is an inclusive environment. Everything that you've heard outside has not been, you're less likely to believe that this space that you're in, in that moment, it's going to be inclusive.

Jennie: So what do we need to do to make this happen?

Jennifer: So many folks on the ground and in communities and across the country to really get involved. And that starts with folks changing how they view sex education. So, like I said, sex education, not being this one-off lecture from your gym teacher or your driver's ed teacher about preventing unintended pregnancies and STIs. We need sex education to be treated in schools. Like we treat them other subjects like math and science and other core subjects that clearly I don't remember, but we also need to look to standards and figure out how we can get these national sex ed standards to be reflected and being taught within school systems. So the great thing about these standards is yeah, we have gone through and we've identified all right, well K-3, here's what young people need to know as it relates to gender identity and sexual orientation, you know, four and five, six through eight, all we have through 12th grade, here's what folks need to know, getting these foundational concepts really early on. They also need trained teachers, right? Understanding the power that they have to creating this safe space for LGBTQ young folks. So I'm feeling like I'm going to ramble off a laundry list, but there's so much that needs to happen. We need to be talking about racism and power and oppression within, as it relates to LGBTQ young people. I think we often separate the two. So like, we'll talk about race and racism on this arm. And then we'll talk about LGBTQ youth and not recognize the overlapping nature of the chew. And then lastly, I think about the folks who are like actively fighting on the ground for this to happen in Missouri, there was this awful anti LGBTQ bill that was presented and folks came to testify at two o'clock in the afternoon. They waited for four hours to actually be able to be heard. They went from being able to have two minutes to only having 30 seconds to testify, but they stayed there for four hours. They spoke for 30 seconds. It lasted for an entire hour, even with the reduction in time, but they pushed back against anti LGBTQ legislation in the state. The last thing I also think we need is we need to recognize it. The interconnectedness of these bills that are being introduced-- anti LGBTQ legislation within states is another way to control bodies and the control who does what and what you're able to do with your body. Same thing for abortion, man, same things for these “religious freedom bills.” These are all interconnected. And once we can start viewing them that way we can start seeing some change and improve the settings for young people in this country.

Jennie: For sure. And that's something we're actually going to be having a deeper conversation about on the podcast is talking about how the anti-trans people are using their “religious freedom” playbook to try to pass their bills. So that's going to be coming out next month. I think they really are, you know, I feel a little bit more prepared…but it is the same playbook that the anti-trans folks are using and so much anti-science.

Jennifer: Yes. And it's also just hate-filled, you know, so much happening.

Jennie: So, well, we always like to end with what actions can the listeners take. So what can we ask listeners to do right now?

Jennifer: Yeah, that's a really great question. So the first thing that I want to instruct or ask you to do, if you're listening to this is look to see what your local policy is, look and see what your school district is teaching. Whether or not it is inclusive of LGBTQ young people. And if it's not find out why, if it is, great, there's always ways to improve it. And so find out what they're teaching and see how you can improve it. If they're not teaching-- rally up some supporters, go to the district, go to a district meeting and demand that the sex education is inclusive. And, you know, you can come onto our website, WWW.SIECUS.org, get more information. We have tons of resources and fact sheets to help you make your case and demand that your school district is supporting and creating these inclusive environments. The other thing that you can do in this right now is to look to see whether or not your state has been putting for these anti-trans anti LGBTQ youth bills. And if they are call demand that you push back on these bills and then work with supportive champions to introduce legislation that are supportive of LGBTQ young people. So those are some things that the state at the federal level, you could see whether or not your member of Congress is a cosponsor of two critical bills, the Real Education for Healthy Youth Act, which is sponsored by Senator Cory Booker and representative Barbara Lee. This would be the first piece of legislation that would mandate comprehensive sex education, defined abstinence only from a federal level. And so you can call and make sure that your representative is a cosponsor of that bill, but educational loans doesn't get us there. So young people need access to services within communities. And so the second piece of legislation federally is the Youth Access to Sexual Health Services. And this bill is sponsored by Senator Hirono and representative Alma Adams. And so you can make sure that you're members of Congress are both sponsors of that. And what that bill would do is increase access to support with an intense focus for prioritizing LGBTQ young people. And so those are two really critical pieces of legislation at the federal level. The last thing, you know, the end of pride, we're still in this Black Lives Matter movement and still talking about policing. So I would be remiss if I didn't talk about kind this idea, we're folks are talking about how you could divest from police within schools and the trauma that young people experience. Especially LGBTQ young people experience when they see these resource officers within their school. And we know that it has an impact. What you could do is find out how much your school is funding these resource officers demand that they reduce that funding, or, you know, divest from these resource officers and reallocate that funding to sexual health educators, mental health professionals, training for teachers that would improve the lives of LGBTQ young people within schools. So those are a couple of, you know, concrete things that you can do right now.

Jennie: That is great list to get started. Yeah. I mean, there's so much work and there's a lot of places where you can get connected.

Jennifer: Right? The last thing that I will say that I don't think get elevated enough is the way that sex education has an impact on, you know, you're learning this stuff in school, but it has an impact on your future self. I think our country could be more inclusive of LGBTQ adults if we're learning this very early on in schools, right. You know, I’ve spoken to someone about the Supreme Court and the ruling around LGBTQ folks and employment and what our society could actually look like. If at a very early age, we started talking about inclusivity and talking about sexual orientation and gender identity and what it means to show up as your full self in schools and how that had changed when you got into the workforce. Right? So we would have a society that really appreciated and valued how folks show up in different capacities. There would be this comfort, you know, it's rare that you can go into different settings, identifying “I am queer.” You know, “I am trans” in a setting without feeling whether or not that's a safe space to do it. And so having these conversations and, and learning early on about how we create these safe and supportive environments early could really impact the way folks show up later in life. I always tell folks that the impact that this has is starting.

Jennie: That is such a hopeful and positive place to stop. Jennifer, thank you so much for doing this.

Jennifer: Thanks so much for having me. I really enjoyed it.

Jennie: Okay. Everybody, I hope you enjoyed this week's interview. So by the time you hear this, we may have already had some more Supreme Court decisions. And with that, we'll be making sure to get out the interviews, talking about what those cases are, as soon as we can. So between this and the next regularly scheduled episode, there could be two to three bonus episodes that are going to talk about the Supreme Court decisions that we're looking for. So the June Medical Services case, looking at abortion access in Louisiana, the birth control benefit case and the anti-prostitution pledge case, which we haven't talked about on the podcast yet, but we will do a special episode. Once the decision has been handed down to talk about what it is and what the decision was with that I will be speaking to y'all very soon and I hope everyone.

Jennie: Thanks for listening everyone. And we'll see you on our next episode of RePROS Fight Back. For more information, including show notes from this episode and previous episodes, please visit our website at reprosfightback.com. You can also find us on Facebook and Twitter at RePROS Fight Back, or on Instagram at reprosfb. If you like our show, please help others find it by sharing it with your friends and subscribing, rating and reviewing us on iTunes. Thanks for listening.

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